Call for Testing: Bluefin LTS (Alpha)

I am pleased to announce a small gift from @tulilirockz , @hanthor, and Jason DeTiberus. Our new collective waking nightmare:

It’s basically Bluefin built on CentOS instead of Fedora, but with the same user experience. We will be prototyping this image as achillobator, but will eventually be pushed to bluefin:lts if there’s interest, commitment from folks, etc. No promises. But … Chonky:

How to get it

Snag the ISO from the github repo and follow the directions. It’s fresh, we recommend a VM for now!

Don’t you always go on and on about scope creep and then you go make an entirely new image?!?

Guilty! Some good news here though! This will be limited scope, it’s purpose is to test the new stuff. So we won’t be building nvidia, dx in here because we may bring some of these methods back into the Bluefin repo, or build out of here. Who knows, so we’re going to try it. Plus adding those will be much simpler now.

Though still rough around the edges, it’s surprisingly complete. It took this ninja team 24h to make this, and let’s be real, most of that was working on bling.

It took over three years to build Universal Blue. And now with bootc, bootc-image-builder, and good old bash and some github actions, the team was able to build this image from scratch, FROM quay.io/centos-bootc/centos-bootc:stream10. From the ground up. In 24 hours.

Other than my doc work this was done entirely by new team members, on their own. Upstream development is firing on all cylinders, their upstream documentation is better than ever, so we’re taking the opportunity to get those teams some usable feedback! Knowing that we can do this so much more quicker is really nice. And for those of you struggling with custom images, this will get much less complex for you too.

Special Thanks

Thanks to Carl George for diving in from CentOS, we would have gone through some deep rabbit holes without your guidance. Hat tip to Colin Walters!

It’s actually trying to descope us

Many parts of ublue are ugly, ancient by cloud native standards some would say. Most of it is hiding all that stuff from you since it’s awful. :smile: We were all in on rpm-ostree moving to a cloud native model, it’s the reason we started the project. But now upstream is in full gear it’s becoming clear that the cruft is getting in the way. We could be going way faster. We have to start from scratch, and as a bonus, we don’t need to churn the bluefin repo.

Rebuilding Bluefin from the ground up is the goal, but we don’t know what that will look like so we just built basic Bluefin and that’s it. Then we’ll look at everything holistically, and with new eyes and contributors and 3 years of experience to have a rethink.

Also related: [Proposal] Consolidate Main, Config, HWE, Akmods, and Kernel Cache · Issue #691 · ublue-os/main · GitHub

Developer Driven

Jason DeTiberus, who worked on this, is a first time contributor, friend, and former coworker of mine who helped build Kubernetes and Cluster API. The main reason we have to try this is that “Enterprise Linux” side of the house has some deep skills, the kind of skills we need. We get these folks helping out, and it bodes well for all of our desktops, we’ll get more good stuff. :smiling_imp:

That’s why I think a CentOS Stream based workstation rounds out the family. We’ll have our options of kernels (which we can just push as new tags, etc), and the apps are all flatpaks anyway.

As always, feel free to ask questions! And I’ll hand it over to @tulilirockz who will explain what uupd is.

Also note, we’re doing this on CentOS Stream itself, if people want Alma or another downstream we leave that up to you. That’s why I chose an Achillobator for this codename, she’s going to be where the action is, right upstream. Bigger claws.

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Hello everyone! As Jorge said, we are testing out Universal Blue Update (uupd) on this image. We’ve noticed that with topgrade we needed to resort to a few workarounds so that we could handle everything we wanted it to handle. This time around, that wont be necessary! UUPD is meant to be a slim updater that updates specifically what the Universal Blue project is aiming to provide in a way that works on systemd services and all the weird environments we want to run it on, without any workarounds, and reliably. This will provide you guys, the end users, a much more stable updating experience, no more “ujust update broke! What do i do?” situations.

This is purposefully meant to be as invisible as possible, so your system will just update to whatever image has uupd in it and continue automatically updating everything as expected. If you still want to see all the fancy UNIXy things on your terminal, you can always run uupd --log-level debug :wink:

I hope you guys like Achillobator as much as I liked helping to create it!

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Installed to a spare drive to test out, looking good…

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Orange GNOME accent color as a flex. Respect!

(Bluefin easter egg: The terminal matches the GNOME accent color you choose for your desktop)

Can’t wait to see where this will go! A bit unfortunate that I just installed Bluefin and rebasing won’t be possible though… :melting_face:

Hey everyone,

I’m testing achillobator on my mini PC. Please find my findings:

  • The installation was blazing fast compared to Bluefin / Aurora / Bazzite
  • U/Just seems to be having a bad day
  • There are references to Brew, but no Brew
  • There are 2 failed units for me
  • Forged date is using/reverting to the default UNIX timestamp

Note: I have added the Flatpaks manually.

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Yes it’s much faster because we shave off a ton of space from the way we’re making ISOs now. And also there’s no flatpak step right now so it’ll be really fast.

just isn’t in EPEL yet so that will need to be a brew install, the brew errors are fixed and I’ve freshened up the ISO. The 1970 thing is probably due to composefs, but if you’ve got a machine with UNIX Epoch as your Forged By date then you’d have the absolutely maximum score on that metric. :smiling_imp:

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Hi, I am going to ask a question since I am not sure I understood completely.

Is this LTS version coming up as based on CentOS because there is no other maintainable version behind the base that GTS is using or is Bluefin in general switching from current Fedora base to a whole new one in the future, too?

Not sure how to get my hear around this. Is a Bluefin GTS user going to be affected in any way by these changes?

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This can’t be true. Blufin is based on Fedora and Red Hat’s ecosystem release cycle:

Fedora moves fast and has latest and the greatest. CentOS Stream is slower, but more stable, because it is base for Red Hat distro that is intended for enterprises that need stability and not the latest and the greatest.

LTS (long term support) can’t be build on Fedora, because Fedora version is supported for 2 years only, because Fedora is fast moving, new ideas distribution.

To have LTS, you need something that is supported and maintained for at least 5 years. CentOS Stream is in this range.

Interesting question. But most probably not. In this moment Blufin streams:

  • latest
  • stable / stable-daily
  • GTS

and LTS is just addition that fits well next to GTS.

We can’t know what future holds. It depends on number of users using each stream.

But if it affects GTS, this will not happen any time soon. GTS is on Gnome 46, and current CentOS Stream v10 (that Bluefin LTS is based on) is already on Gnome 47. If this affects GTS in future, migration is super easy just rebasing to new image and maintainers will do this for you. Most users may not even notice the change.

Those plans are too far away, probably at least a year or so, just because of Gnome version itself and word in cloud native desktop spins in twice the speed of thought.

We are building a prototype Bluefin LTS. That’s it. This doesn’t affect anything else we’re doing, it’s additive.

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If I understand correctly, Cent OS isn’t immutable, so does that mean Achillobator (Bluefin LTS) won’t be immutable either? It won’t be changed to immutable down the road?

I just installed it in a VM to try it, and it has sudo dnf commands available.

It’s the same thing as Bluefin is now except based on CentOS instead of Fedora, neither of them are immutable.

Sorry, I got the terminology mixed up. I meant ‘atomic’ in the Fedora sense.

My understanding is that Bluefin was built on Fedora Silverblue, which is atomic.

Ok ok. There’s no “CentOS Silverblue” but there’s a stripped down base image so we had to assemble that: GitHub - centos-workstation/main: CentOS Stream-based base image to mostly fake it.

Then we build on top of that to make the new image.

Tried building a ARM64 version of Achillobator a M1 MBA today. ARM64 support on CentOS is sweet! Only took about 20 minutes of work to build this. The rest of time was waiting for images to build :sweat_smile:

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